WCL Results

[Randy Pogue]

Word on the street is:
Peyton won rd. 1.
Dan Erickson got caught with a right hand.
Stephen came at Ray with a blitz, hit the red area, and torqued his knee. He's done, after 15 seconds of fighting. too bad on many levels. I hope he's ok. good luck to Ray in the next round.

[P.J. Reilly]

Thanks Randy, keep it coming!

[Randy Pogue]

I need to amend the Wonderboy report.

Apparently once on the red area, Ray grabbed Stephen by the back of the neck and pushed him down, causing the knee twist.

I hear that replay has concluded it was an illegal move, but don't know that for sure or what the consequence could be.

Stephen is in the ER with a torn MCL & possibly a torn ACL.

that is all for now.

[P.J. Reilly]

That's terrible news. I truly hope that this was an accident. Also hope that it's not an ACL tear.

[Pete P]

That sucks to hear! Hope WB is ok and heals quickly. Hey, on a side note...is Stephen training Muay Thai now? On the WCL website it talks about his firey punches and "vicious Muay Thai skills that engulf his opponents". Is that just good writing, or is WB cross training now?

[Megan Thompson]

Hey Hey Hey! I see Randy has updated everyone. Stephen is in a brace and on crutches until he gets home. He has to go see an orthapedic surgeon and also have an MRI done on his knee so that they can determine 100% on what all exactly is wrong with it. I think like a torn MCL and possibly a torn ACL. I hope not but we will see. I do know that it is bad and he cannot put ANY weight on it at all. This happened within like 15 seconds into the round. I'm sure that my dad or someone who was there will get on here and update everyone on how everything EXACTLY happened.
p.s. Pete- No, Stephen is not specifically training muay thai- he is just training! If you know what I mean :D

[LMITCHUM]

Lets hope for the best........would be a terrible loss if this ended his career. Lets pray for healing and best wishes to the Thompson family and especially the Wonderboy. If anyone can heal perhaps he can. This really stinks.....I hope it was not intentional and accidental. This ruined my morning.

Larry

[fighterzack]

Do not worry, Wonderboy will be back. I have had both injuries, a torn MCL and a torn ACL, and two surgeries on the same knee, and I still fight, even Thai rules. Stephen was in incredible shape going in to the fight, and this will help the healing as well. He will put as much into his rehab as he does his training, and be back fighting within the year. He is a champion, in every sense of the word.

I do hope it was accidental also. I heard that they were reviewing the tape of the incident, and that it looked as if Daniels had pushed Stephen down. I do not think he would have meant to cause this injury, however, but does anyone know what the final ruling was, on the fight itself, and the infraction, if it was ruled one.

[P.J. Reilly]

Does anyone have full results? I looked on the maslinc.com and worldcombatleague.com and they have some results but they also have conflicting stories as to what actually happened.

[Brian Schwartz]

I spoke to Raymond last night after the fight and he said that the push was not intentional. I've known Raymond for years and he is not the type of fighter that would intentionally try to injure someone. Stephen's injury was very unfortunate and I hope he has a speedy recovery.

[Megan Thompson]

I just wanted to update everyone on Stephen's knee. He is at the hospital having an MRI done right now. However he had an appointment with the orthapedic doctor this morning and from the examination it was made official that he does indeed have a torn MCL and a torn meniscus. There is a very strong possibility that the ACL is torn as well. The MRI will determine that and will also determine how bad the meniscus is torn. If it is torn only on the outer edge/s it should heal itself, if it is torn towards the center it will require surgery. Of course the ACL would require surgery. I believe the MCL will heal itself over time but I am not sure on that. He was given a better brace but he is still unable to put any weight on it! I will update everyone when we get the results from the MRI.

[LMITCHUM]

Thanks Megan.........how is your Dad taking all of this? And wasn't the Wonderboy's knee hurt a few months ago?

Still praying he will be ok..

Larry

[Megan Thompson]

Larry, To be honest with you I have not even spoken to my dad since before they left for Austin. I am sure he is doing just fine and is taking the necessary steps to get Stephen healed up as quickly as possible! Stephen's leg was hurt from the last fight but it was not his knee he took an elbow right above his knee in the Carlos Tearney fight, and his leg was just bruised stiff. It was nothing SEVERE like this. You know bumps and bruises are to be expected. I heard that this time the reffing and the judging was pitiful and that Kevin Engel was ripped off! Has anyone heard about Kevin's fight?

[LMITCHUM]

Thanks for the info Megan and I have heard your dad complain about ref's in the past.

Larry

[bigjack]

I really don't want to get into how the injury took place on this post..my son had a similar injury ...the minus was slightly torn and the ligamnets were stretched. we did the MRI thing and it looked bad. the suggestion was to scope the knee to repair the miniscus and tighten the ligaments...we passed and did the wholistic and chiropratic. the chiropratic was to insure the knee was in place as the knee healed. there's a great suppliment that we used called ligaplex by standard products and we used Sam e to help with some of the cartilage repair. He healed well but it took 8 mths before he felt like he might fight again and over a year to get to 100%. I can't tell you how important keeping the knee and leg in place while it healed was.

[Black Belt Grandma]

I"ve been reading for the past few days all the comments about the Thompson/Daniels fight. While I don't know Mr. Daniels I understand he is a police officer. My son is also a police officer and I appreciate his job. I'm not a kickboxer or karate expert but I do have some folks involved in that arena. My two grandsons are personally trained by Steven Thompson and one has achieved Jr. Black Belt status. Being a kickboxer isn't just what Steven does it's who he is. I'm personally acquainted with him and have watched him not only in the ring but outside as well. I respect all martial arts athletes because it takes great determination to get to the level these guys are at. However, class isn't something you get it's something you are and Steven is certainly first class. Day to day he is an example to approximately 400 students he either teaches or helps train. They range in age from 3 years to adults who consistently follow the example he sets both for himself and his school. Pride, respect and integrity is what he stands for and teaches. There's a certain T-shirt floating around that says this "trained by Steven 'wonderboy' Thompson." I'm not qualified to wear that shirt but those who are wear it with pride. Mr. T., Megan and B, if you know David and Wyatt "the riot" then you'll probably know me. I'm that black-belt grandma they love. I am a praying person and know many who are. They will have the wonderboy in their prayers during the agonizing month's ahead. Class, it's what you are.......or maybe like big jack........what you're not.

[bigjack]

that was a classless remark. :) I love you guys if i defend my friend from what will be totally false accusations point out who started the trash talking that had nothing to do with the injury or stephen. our coach goes to the hospital to see how stephen is and his dad files a protest over a freak accident. Ray and Stephen are probably great guys and what ever disrespect you may precieve from me is only in response to the ...he's a crap throwing coward who was going to run from wonderboy and did a grabbling mma type move to take him to the groung and hurt him accustions....racperez has the best description of what happened over on the wcl site.

[jean-luc]

As far as classless remarks are concerned, you are a real expert Big Jack.

[bigjack]

you lead the way I posted all your bs all over the place.

[jean-luc]

Well for those who would have missed this piece of litterature, I reproduce here Mr Big Jack's first post on the topic (01-23-2007 at 06:10 PM). I think everybody will be able to appreciate the way Mr Big Jack speaks about a young man who has been severly injured :

" I didn't know kickboxers were such cry babies. there was no illegal push I was there. looked like the old ali putting that left out there to measure his opponent. Ray was about to start to light him up. wonderboy didn't and doesn't have the movement, speed or reach to handle someone like Ray. It's a shame no wants to look at the tape and how you wonderboy went at ray with his head down looking like he was trying to swim. when you see the tape it looks like wonderboy took a dive.. he knew he was in over his head but unlike you guys I'll take the word of Mr Thompson that his boy is really hurt from a freak accident but to think that an extented left that was measuring your man up was some kind of illegal move that crippled your fighter please if that all it took to stop this guy then be glad it was over in 29 seconds....Vickers would really put his lights out if he decides to lose 5 pounds".

[bigjack]

this guy is a trip and i quess stephen's dad has commissioned this Kool aid drinkers attempts at deceipt and deception.. I posted this several places in response to this blind kool aid drinking disciple of coach thompson who evidently worships at the alter of wonderboy...

man we're not going to be able to have a civil converstion I don't guess..remember that this all started with me posting coach thomson was going to have to get some kickboxers that can handle the pointfighters orginal quote

It is a shame the Mr. Steven Thompson got hurt, I hope he heals quickly.. It looks like Coach Thompson needs some kick boxers that can handle the point fighters check out mr vicker's point fighting on youtube WCL knockout...I WASN'T EVEN REFERRING TO THE RAY/WONDERBOY FIGHT!!! Hello.. Donald.. you tube...

when all you blind wonderboy kool aid drinking went off and were hell bent on accusing Ray of using an illgal technique either intentionally which is obscene or unintentionally which is stupid.

the whole idea of megans that Ray used a technique that only grapplers or mma fighters use that wcl don't train for ,I bet is her dad's rendition, is what this is all about.. my original at the time good natured chide actually was about donald knocking out a world kickboxing champion.

jean luc you are and have been trying to get people to belive that ray used some illegal technique which didn't happen and I will not let you spread the Thompson propaganda without a defense of my friend. anyway jean luc decided to post over on ems' site and I replied in a manner reflecting the respect the jean luc and the kickboxing kook aid drinkers have given Ray and the pointfihgters in general

"being the cry baby and the ultimate deceiver that jean luc apparently is I'm suprized that I was this nice... this chump and the wonderbread bakers were already accusing ray of an illegal technique..at this point I have every intent on being as respectful as they have been...I think everybody likes stephen its his dad and all the kool aid drinkers that have accused Ray of intentionally or unitentionally using an illegal move to hurt their wonderboy that I take issue with.

so please for those of you that have be loyal and civil supporters of stephen this and most of my others have not and are not meant for you.

jean luc is a liar and trying to con all those who are wanting to blame somebody for a freak accident I posted my first post what he posted was my response to all the kool aid drinkers that had to have somebody to blame for their hero getting hurt

[admin]

Big Jack,

Let's settle this babble once and for all. WHERE can ANY of us see a video of the 29 seconds of this fight?:cool:

All these words are worthless here, let's see the video! Is it on You Tube?
Brett!

[bigjack]

There is nothing i would like better. I would love to talk about something else other than the kool aid drinkers trying to make a case for some kind of illegal etc.. and just leave it alone for a while. I do resent the fact that this all started with his dad's rant at the event and others picked it up .

the view I had and the one that is from the camera faciing the audience looking a stephen..it has a clear view at what happened...until then I wish jean luc and others would just quit making a case for illegal anything.

the only people that have it are the wcl people and they may do nothing with it given all the controversy....all i know is the pointfighters have done well, I still don't know what kind of money is over here in the full contact side, would it be worth it for my son to cross over, what are the politics, my luck is thompson runs this damn thing over here . What is the IKF what are its rules what other full contact opportunities are there etc... I would much rarther learn from and learn about you people then always be over here defending, whether he needs or not, my friend my son's big brother Raymond.

[admin]

Are you saying you are Ray Daniels father? Or you are friends with his father?:confused:

It would be just like the wcl to not release the video, opting instead to just let the contraversey go on and on. The TRUTH seems to be missing here. You would think BECAUSE of such a fight, the wcl would at the very least make a statement on their site. This alone is a shock that they have not stepped up to do so. What did the wcl folks rule the call? What did the Texas Athletic Commission rule the call? Did they call it a "No Contest" or a TKo ot what? I'd like to know what they officially ruled it as.:eek:

[bigjack]

I am friends with his father and have known Ray forever....I don't care if they call it a no contest, a loss , TKO so long as it is based on the fact he got hurt from a freak accident that Ray had nothing to do with. I think the ruling was it was a loss do to the fact stephen could not continue...they are suppose to make a ruling and a statement I hope they do it quickly.

[admin]

Let us all judge by seeing the [size=6][color=yellow]VIDEO![/color][/size]Or did it become mysteriously lost?:confused:
funny how the Dan Erickson KO ended up on you Tube, but the Thompson-Danials one? Hummmmmm did not......:confused: :rolleyes:

[Mark Martin]

I've previously posted on the WCL site that I watched a video after the fight. Watched it slowed to frame by frame. It may not be at an angle the WCL has but I believe a hold and push/throw are clearly evident. My guess is if the WCL rules otherwise the video won't be released.

[admin]

[color=yellow][/color]
[color=yellow]"hold and push/throw are clearly evident"[/color]

Interesting.
I look forward to viewing it myself someday, but as you say, they may keep this video in the vault. If they see what you see, the fear of Insurance may play a factor here. Were these guys insured for such an injury?:eek:

[bigjack]

if you saw a video then post the damn thing they played it over and over again at the event and the angle looking at the audience shows clearly ray had nothing to do iwth the injury. there was no hold no push GO TO THE WCL SIGHT AND LOOK AT WHAT THOSE HAD TO SAY THAT HAD NO DOG IN THE FIGHT.

What difference does it make at this point... you all have already conceeded that the pointfighters have an advantage and if stephen would have lost it would have been because of the venue...

serious note and we can be civil if anybody wants to...I think what it is, I'll ask the kids again, I think they are insured up to 10,000 dolllars if this is the injury his dad said it was it may take much more than that to repair his knee.

Although it's obvious I'm upset with all the drama stephens dad started. My heart does go out to him..like I said, there was a year a few years ago when we weren't sure whether Jack would be able to compete or compete at the level he was at ever agian ..that's tough for a dad who is as involved with his son as I was and Mr. Thosmpson is.

[jean-luc]

I think the video I saw and I have been talking about must be the same as Mark Martin because we were together with Stephen and other friends at a restaurant after the event and that's where the video was shown to me on the screen of the cell phone it had been shot with. The impression I had was exactly that expressed by Mark, that there were a "hold and a push/throw" to quote his own words. I sent an e-mail to the person who showed me the video and I am still expecting his answer. If he sends me the video and allows me to post it, I will do that immediately.
However, with its three huge cameras, the WCL itself must have videos of much better quality than the one I saw. That's the reason why I always said I would like to see the WCL videos, in order to be able to check whether my impression is right.

[Mark Martin]

bigjack, I don't have the video nor do I have access to it. I was also there ( four rows from the matt) and saw the replays on the screen. I don't think that main angle was the best but I do believe it's sufficient to show what happened. You've gotten on Ray Thompson for saying something at the event. Of course he did. He's the coach. It was his son. If you were standing with the LA team he was as close as you and he called Daniels on it Immediately. He should have, he's the coach. As soon as he had taken Stephen off he went to the WCL officials at Ringside. You could tell from the stands he brought his view to their attention to it. No one expects that anyone from the LA side would jump up and say, "our guy held him and threw him down!" When has a basketball coach ever jumped up from the sidelines or a football coach run onto the field to get in front of an official and say OUR guy was fouling/holding the opponent? It's always the team fouled that speaks up. It's no different here. Coach thompson did what he should have in reaction to what he saw. So now we wait for the WCL.

[bigjack]

it never happened. one more time the only people who even entertained there was some kind of foul are you people with randy's acount being the most outrageous. dad was over the top period. go over to the wcl site and see what those who have no ties to amyone says. thompson puts danny anige to shame. I can understand the concern of a father I can't understand having to find somebody to blame.

[Mark Martin]

I've read what they posted there. The opinions of those, some who btw stated prior to the fight they were pulling for Daniels, and one who stated he/she thought Daniels would knock Thompson out if the fight continued, hold no weight. To conclude what would have happened is presumptuous and evidences their pre-fight bias. In no way does any of that over-ride what I've seen in slow motion. Randy's account ( I believe communicated as it was given to him) may be the most accurate. The only issue for me is the credibility of the WCL. Will they uphold the rules they have in place? Again, we wait to see.

[bigjack]

you know even Mr. Engle says if there was anything it was unintentional the idea that ray grabbed and threw stephen is just bs. post this damn thing you've seen in slow mo...ohh i forgot you can't do that..fine give stephen the penality point and make a 15-1 ruling if it makes you happy.

you can't stand the fact that stephen has a loss on his record.....What I'd like to see is an official statement of there was no foul (thompson and you clowns exposed as the propagandists you are)and because it lasted only 29 seconds call it a no contest.

[jean-luc]

Big Jack writes :
" you can't stand the fact that stephen has a loss on his record....."

No, that's not what we can't stand : being compelled to give up after 30 seconds due to a bad injury is not a loss even it if is recorded like that. I hope for Mr Daniels he has more glorious "victories" on his record.

What we can't stand is that Stephen has been fouled and, as a result of this foul, is so badly injured that he is out of action for at least one year and nobody can guarantee that he will ever fully recover.

[bigjack]

you are a whinner and a cry baby there was no foul, no foul was called, only the OPINIONS,accusations and character assault of his father and people like you. Those are the facts my whinny sharpe as a marble thompson disciple. Until, upon further review, the facts are there was no foul, stephen has a loss on his record, he has a blown knee from a freak accident. There is no reason for the WCL to say or do anything unless they are going to change the ruling or the scoring. They have had plenty of time .. they aren't going to do anything because the had it right the first time and there isn't anything to do.

what is interesting is the refs were throwing yellow cards for most anything and there was nothing thrown in this instance and yet dispite the facts you are along with others are hell bent on seeing the decision overturned or raymond penalized...What else is interesting to my knowledge..I don't think there's a brother among you that are hell bent on seeing Ray's rep tarnished.....

[jean-luc]

There was a foul, as e.g. Mark Martin confirmed after reviewing an amateur video. The foul was most probably not committed with the intention to harm Stephen but it caused his injury.

[jean-luc]

To illustrate further my opinion on the case, I find it useful to remind an incident that happened during the very first fight of the inaugural event of the WCL in Dallas, TX, on October 12, 2005. I quote from the report released on the site of Sportmartialarts
(http://www.maslinc.com/index.cfm?action=maslinc.news&show=article&articleID=415&topic=Review)

" Los Angeles won the opening coin toss and selected Peyton Russell, an international kickboxing champion as their first match fighter. He faced Ryan Madigan, a full contact and muay thai fighter. When the opening bell rang, the two fighters went hard but a spinning elbow by Russell caught Madigan in the head, opening up a gash that bled sufficiently for the medic to declare Madigan unable to continue. Since the cut was caused by an illegal technique, Russell was disqualified and Madigan won the round for his team."

I know Peyton Russell quite well and so do many readers of this message board. He is a perfect gentleman inside and outside the ring. He would never hurt intentionally an opponent with an illegal move. I would bet my annual salary that he had no intention whatsoever to injure Ryan Madigan. But he did injure him and the technique he used was illegal (not intentionally, it was just bad luck). The decision of the judges was the right one and Peyton Russell did not argue.

I am convinced that the Thompson-Daniels incident was something similar : a foul done without intention to harm, which, however, results in an injury. There are only two differences in my view : Daniels' foul was less visible than Peyton's and, unfortunately enough, the injury was much more serious.

I have no reason to doubt that Mr Raymond Daniels is a gentleman and I never questioned his integrity. It just happened that he fouled Stephen (I am sure he did it without malicious intention) and, unfortunately enough, this foul resulted in a dramatic and totally unpredictable injury. I never said anything else.

[Prince]

MAN BIGJACK THE ONLY WHINNING AND CRYING I SEE ON THIS BOARD IS YOU. THATS WHY THERE ARE BOARDS TO LOOK AT FIGHT. BE A MAN AND SWALLOW THE OLIVE.........SON. AND QUIT TRYING TO THROW THE RACE CARD "IF IT'S A SLIP...IT FITS" YOUR NOT JOHNNY.

THE PRINCE

[admin]

Bigkack,

You said below, "stephen has a loss on his record, he has a blown knee from a freak accident."

If the wcl were to ack like a "REAL" organization, the bout would be ruled a "No contest" or a "Disqualification" if they had any BALLS to make such a call.

This is because the bout ended in an injury. The only decision to make next is was it intentional or not. If not, it should be a "No contest". NOT a win for Daniels you unknowledgable idiot!

If it was intentional, Daniels should lose by DQ, be disqualified from the event as well as FINED and suspended. THIS is how a REAL Organization would have delt with it!

However, the wcl IS NOT a REAL organization are they. They have their own officials and sanction their own events. The state of Texas is in bed with Chuck and his group so they won't say anything. THIS is why events are SANCTIONED! To assure ALL fighters are treated FAIR, NOT what's best for the promotion.

THIS act here could very well be the DOWNFALL of the wcl! They have road their own pony this year and if states continue to allow them to continue to do so, more things like this will continue to happen.

This is proven even more by your own comment,
"There is no reason for the WCL to say or do anything unless they are going to change the ruling or the scoring."

OF COURSE THEY WON'T!
Because it will harm the "Promotion!"

These guys are not looking out for the FIGHTERS!
They are looking out for their PROMOTION ONLY!

AGAIN, this is why events are sanctioned! Yes, I'm talkin IKF Talk here, but seriously, this is why. The other downfall is if wcl does sanction their events, they will use some joke org like iska who cory has already run into the ground by leaving it and doing k-1 circus crap and now this wcl stuff, while ignoring the iska. In doing so, it's become a JOKE of an organization, only used by those who DON'T want to be held responsable to anyone because all iska does is collect a promoters fee and have the promoter's friend be their event representative. THIS I DO KNOW ABOUT THE SPORT!

SO IN DOING SO, WCL IS BACK TO SQUARE ONE. Sanctioning themselves.


Oh and bigjack a s s, you love to end with your brotha comments don't ya,

"I don't think there's a brother among you that are hell bent on seeing Ray's rep tarnished....."

This isn't about Ray is it? It's about your racial issues!


THIS IS NOT THE PLACE TO WIN SUCH A STUPID RACE WAR SO STOP WITH THAT S X I T RIGHT NOW YOU IDIOT!:eek:

PS, for the record, "I'm a BROTHA!!!!!" And guys like you make US all look like idiots!

[bigjack]

I don't care about what they call so long as whatever they call it has nothing to do with what Ray did. There was no foul, no illegal technique,some sloppy technique maybe, and ray had absolutely nothing to do with stephens injury.

take that up with the WCL and leave ray out of it.

making you look like idiots is easy

Ali was hated the way you guys hate ray just because he beat all the hero's of his day right.

[jean-luc]

As I said in two of my previous posts, I totally agree with you on the substance : there was clearly a foul and the fair and logical outcome of the fight should be a no contest if the foul is not intentional and the disqualification of Daniels if it is.

However, I don't think it would be fair to criticize the WCL BEFORE they have made their decision on the protest. We have a priori no reason to believe that they will base their decision on commercial or promotional reasons. Maybe I am a bit naïve but I assume that they are men of integrity who want to do the right thing and I hope they will make a fair decision based on clear and verifiable evidence. If they don't, then it will be time to criticize them and I will certainly do.

And, to answer one of your questions, as far as I remember, even a disqualification of Raymond Daniels, which would give a 15-0 victory to Thompson, instead of the opposite, wouldn't change the winning team. But I may be wrong : does anybody remember the precise scoring ?

[jean-luc]

There is a full report of the WCL Austin event on the site of Sportmartialarts http://www.maslinc.com/index.cfm?action=maslinc.news&show=article&articleid=547&topic=Review

And, to answer a question posed by Admin, the final score was Philadelphia 95 - Los Angeles 144. So, even if the 3 experts decided to disqualify Raymond Daniels and to give Stephen a 15-0 victory, that wouldn't change the final result. The score would be Philadelphia 110 – Los Angeles 129.